INTERVIEW: Cursed Films 2 with Writer/Director Jay Cheel

Just as he was touching up the final episode, writer and director Jay Cheel chatted with Hear Us Scream about season two of Shudder’s original series Cursed Films, premiering April 7.

Season one focused on horror films, but this season delves into Wizard of Oz. Is this because of the film’s dangerous work environment, or were you drawn to it for a different reason?

I think The Wizard of Oz, in terms of “cursed films,” is up there with a lot of the films we covered in the first season. It is horror-adjacent. But I think there’s still horror elements to it—with the witch, and the flying monkeys. And I know there’s a huge group of people who feel that sort of kindertrauma experience as a kid with The Wizard of Oz. I had that experience. So it feels like some of the imagery is still kind of horror-related. But it was also the decision of, even if it’s not a horror film, maybe the things that happened during production are horrific. The stories surrounding these productions, that’s where some of the horror comes from. We just wanted to expand our definitions this season.

In season one you showed us that “cursed films” are typically the result of accidents or poor workplace conditions. Was this the intent, and can we expect the same from season two?

When talking about something being cursed—there is that element of actually feeling like there might have been a curse put on the production because of subject matter or someone involved with the production doing some sort of witchcraft or something. Usually what we’re referring to is when everything is going so wrong that you say to yourself, “It feels like we’re cursed.” With these productions, it seems that usually comes down to lack of planning, maybe a little—well, in the case of The Serpent and The Rainbow—a naïve plan to shoot in Haiti after a revolution, and assume that everything’s going to go as planned. So, it’s kind of steering away from the supernatural, but there is that element still. With Rosemary’s Baby, the subject matter does kind of suggest that, when you represent dark material like that, are you allowing forces in to give it this bad energy? 

Is there any overarching theme or message that we can look forward to the way we did in season one?

This season, it does feel more like five documentaries about the making of these five films. But going into it, I think season one, the thought was that it was about the rational versus irrational. With this season it kind of feels like it’s more about the real versus the unreal. Some of the films deal with their legacy coming from a blurring of the lines as to what is real and what isn’t, in terms of what you’re seeing on screen, and that adding to the legacy of it being cursed. It also touches on what is real and what isn’t in terms of the stories we’ve heard. Especially in The Wizard of Oz episode, there’s some discussion surrounding the legacy of the film, and the legacy of Judy Garland, and how the cursed stories have potentially taken some of the attention away from that legacy. Especially in the eyes of the Oz historians that we talk to.

What’s a kind of film or theme that you’re seeing more of and you enjoy?

Obviously, with the pandemic, there are some things that are starting to pop up in films that I think will be there for a while as we (cinematically) work through everything that we’ve gone through the past two years. I’m always attracted to character-based stories, which is why with this show, I think for me the cursed stories are kind of second to getting to talk to some of the people involved with those productions, or the bad things that might have happened. So for me, it’s all about character. The Worst Person in the World was a film I really loved that deals with characters in such an interesting way, in terms of the complexity of trying to make your way through the world and being the best person you can possibly be, but realizing that it can sometimes be tough when you’re faced with human challenges.

A bit off-topic, but is there a director or a film right now that you’re excited about?

Well, everyone is talking about the Daniels’ (Daniel Kwan and Daniel Sheinert) film Everything Everywhere All at Once. I’m curious about that. A lot of people seem to be talking about it as though it’s pushing some cinematic extremes. I’m seeing it mentioned in the same breath as Evil Dead 2, so I’m very curious to check that out, just based on what they’ve been able to accomplish in terms of pushing the boundaries of the cinema language.

Thank you, and congrats on the new season!

Thank you, I hope you like it. I keep saying it’s kind of like the B-sides to the first season’s A-sides. The films are a little more esoteric—except for, you know, The Wizard of Oz is obviously a popular film. But in terms of the horror perspective, I think we have a good collection of stories and characters this season.